The New Kreigsmarine

SHAD0Wdump · Post by **SHAD0Wdump** » Tue May 05, 2009 2:45 am

Press Z,then you can press tilde and 1-4 to get more.

You can also open your custom sprites folder in the BSF directory and drag anything you want in there directly into the shipmaker screen.

Imperator Pavel I · Post by **Imperator Pavel I** » Tue May 05, 2009 3:19 am

drekisol,
Thanks for the answer

Use the embeddable cod instead of a thumbnail

This is a ligt carrier Drache:

The Ship Deployer deploys these:

That is actually to scale!

I edited the Bismarck:

With Ageis:

Invisible Ageis

MelvinVm · Post by **MelvinVm** » Tue May 05, 2009 4:00 am

Allright, some good/pro tips that will must be read.
Stop the skinny ships, they have EMPTY stuff INSIDE, looks ugly, and structure-wise, its not really useful.
A bit on the aegis AND deflector spam, try to lessen that.
Avoid this colorful color scheme, ugly looking.
Bismarck is skinny, very skinny, its a SKELETON ship, it needs beef in there, and a different gun layout might be actually recreating the historical ship, this is just bad, even if you're new, look at other people's ships, see how they make their ships, both shapes and texture.

maarten · Post by **maarten** » Tue May 05, 2009 4:05 am

Okay... where should I start?

The Bismarck is the worst ship posted in the last month, maybe even year, because:
Enormous spam, You got explanations on the groups now f*cking use it.
Aegis spam, Same thing, use deflectors instead, looks better and is more realistic.
weapon placement, they are all forward. You can rotate them with the I and K keys.
Colours, it's a miracle there haven't been any; "Oh my fucking eyes" comments yet. How would you build your personal battleship: Super coloured shooting practive or sleek nice looking colours that actually don't clash.

Top tips:
If you start out build the ship in 1 or 2 colours, to show depth or later on colourssheme, you can always change them.
Don't ever use 2 of the same sections after eachother.(exeption; chains and parts that are ment to be this way.
Scale the pieces if there is no other way.(do this with the J and l keys.???? not really shure but.... you get the point.)
READ THE F*CKING MANUAL! Open it in the shipmaker with the "F1" key.
Cut down the weapons, just use slightly less weapons and spawn more ships if you really want bullets flying all over the place. Also is more appealing to the eye.

Now I got a challenge for you. Build a ship which uses:

1 Differant shades of the same colour, to a maximum of 3 differant colours and 5 shapes per colour.

2 differant sections next to eachother so no more the same sections touching or even being over existing.

3 No more then 12 guns.

4 No aegis.

5 Up to 1 module.

And please make a sketch first. the use that picture as guidline. And think which combination of pieces looks the most like the parts of the ship.

I hope this isn't offending to you but we are all just trying to help you.

MelvinVm · Post by **MelvinVm** » Tue May 05, 2009 4:13 am

@Maarten, this is not a flamewar, and you can say "fuck" in here.
Also get a spelling checker, I prefer grammar errors over spelling ones.

As I don't agree with some tips, theres some I agree with, aegis for example, nobody uses them these days, more than 12 guns is fine for me, as long as it aint 12 HUGE guns.
Section spam should greatly be reduced.
And stop with "CUNT U READ" posts, they are generally annoying, and not helping these fine people of the internet.

Swamp Fox · Post by **Swamp Fox** » Tue May 05, 2009 4:23 am

maarten wrote:The Bismarck is the worst ship posted in the last month, maybe even year

Oh, please. I'll admit that his section usage is horrible, the colors are irritating, and the module placement needs improvement, but this statement is just plain wrong. Far worse ships can, and have been, churned out by inexperienced, over-eager shipwrights. I know. I made some of them. In the last month, I'll agree that this is right up there, but the last year? Unless you are willing to go back and actually look at every ship produced in that time-frame, this statement should not be uttered. Since it was, I will assume you did not manually check every other ship produced in the last year, and point you to the "Grand Cruiser/knock your socks off" thread. So please, use your brain, and don't make such gross generalizations, especially when they have little to no merit.

Kanosint · Post by **Kanosint** » Tue May 05, 2009 4:39 am

Swamp Fox wrote:
maarten wrote:The Bismarck is the worst ship posted in the last month, maybe even year
Oh, please. I'll admit that his section usage is horrible, the colors are irritating, and the module placement needs improvement, but this statement is just plain wrong. Far worse ships can, and have been, churned out by inexperienced, over-eager shipwrights. I know. I made some of them. In the last month, I'll agree that this is right up there, but the last year? Unless you are willing to go back and actually look at every ship produced in that time-frame, this statement should not be uttered. Since it was, I will assume you did not manually check every other ship produced in the last year, and point you to the "Grand Cruiser/knock your socks off" thread. So please, use your brain, and don't make such gross generalizations, especially when they have little to no merit.

Though I, by no means, support maarten, I must say that in the last month, this is by far the worst POSTED section usage, weapon/aegis spam, and general other newbie mistakes that could've been solved by lurking a little longer... Maarten also said 'maybe' for the year-comment... I agree that that's just not true, though, because I can recall a number of ships which were worse than these.

Still, the section spam of the sec22 variety is rather horrible, definetely something that should be dealt with even BEFORE all other flaws... The colours could be at least acceptable if the general ship outlay was aesthetically pleasing, even the current Aegis and weapon spam is somewhat livable if this section usage error is dealt with... Still not GOOD, but at least livable enough. So I'd say work on that first, use custom-made sections if you deem it necessary, but right now I see ugly hunks of technicolor scrap... No more, but no less either.

Imperator Pavel I · Post by **Imperator Pavel I** » Tue May 05, 2009 6:24 am

The Bismarck is bad, I know, what can I do to improve it?

I put 20 more sections in the back, to form a carrier deck.

Would anyone like to describe the Drache?

And one more thing, maarten, I accept your Challenge

Wicky_42 · Post by **Wicky_42** » Tue May 05, 2009 7:03 am

Mr Pavel, dude, just have a look at some other ships, then at yours. There's so much there that should be blindingly obvious - just look, get some inspiration and come back again. We shouldn't have to walk you through creating a cohesive colour scheme, solid, logical designs and the general basics of ship design. Have a go at helping yourself.

All your ships so far have shown an aggravating lack of lurking. Please, just look around some at the older ships. Hell, have a look at some ancient Sb2 ships just to get some idea for how to put sections together in a way that works.

Elias_The_Crimson · Post by **Elias_The_Crimson** » Tue May 05, 2009 3:33 pm

Imperator Pavel I wrote:The Bismarck is bad, I know, what can I do to improve it?

I put 20 more sections in the back, to form a carrier deck.

Would anyone like to describe the Drache?

Looking at the Bismark, I suspect you went to create the outline of the ship hull first using the Stock22 section, and then omitted filling the inner parts of the ship with sections for reasons unknown - possibly laziness or simply because you couldn't come up with any ideas.
Please, avoid leaving voids within the hull. The almost always make the ship look horribly fragile no matter what.

Also, please stop using the horrible color schemes. Strong colors (dark blue and stock green in particular) thrown together looks awful in all possible applications. Normally, shipbuilders pick a color scheme with one or two strong colors for creating contrast/emphasis on certain parts somewhere on the ships, and the rest being "humble" colors meant for creating that feel of depth (usually 2-4 shades of a similar color with different darkness). Cartoony and eye-catching colors may be useful in other applications but in BSF it accomplishes nothing good.

You should also tone down on the weapon and modules usage. I know you want to make your ships to stand strong against infinite waves of enemies, but try to think realistically for a second. No ships are indestructible, nor should they be no matter what your balance standard is.

Regarding the "Drache", it suffers from the same problems as your other ships, namely an eye-burning color scheme and weapon/module spam. It has an incredible number of point defense flaks but still apparently needs 8 (?) shield modules to cover its 10-12 sections. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that it's a total overkill.

Read this if you haven't already: http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB2/viewtopic ... ght=#80745

maarten · Post by **maarten** » Tue May 05, 2009 6:45 pm

Okay okay, I admit this isn't the worst of the year. A mistake and I am sorry for it.
One more thing: You can change the depth of sections in the shipmaker. Just rightclick them, and go to the set depth or Up/Down buttons.

Sorry if my way of saying things seems harsh but it's my way. If you feel offended or attacked in any way just say so.

Imperator Pavel I · Post by **Imperator Pavel I** » Tue May 05, 2009 9:19 pm

maarten, This is my answer to your challenge:

The new Hermann-class patrol craft:

Just tell me if I am missing anything

MelvinVm · Post by **MelvinVm** » Tue May 05, 2009 9:28 pm

the challenge ship is again, very SKELETON, theres no meat in it!

The colors are HORRIBLE.

A bit on the heavy weapon side tho.

Imperator Pavel I · Post by **Imperator Pavel I** » Tue May 05, 2009 9:33 pm

jwa8402 · Post by **jwa8402** » Tue May 05, 2009 10:20 pm

an amendment to the challenge. Unless its an antenna, engine, or weapon mount, try not to have any one section only touching one other section. Link up one more section to every section you have there and it gets beefy fast.
Also, if you mirror a ship, generally match the colors. You have no one section the same color and thats not what he meant.