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PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 4:30 am 
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Meh, it'll run into an upswing after the market is flooded with crap for long enough and people start giving up.

Just the market rearranging itself. Pirates just exist to fullfill a demand void.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 7:16 am 
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antisocialmunky wrote:
Meh, it'll run into an upswing after the market is flooded with crap for long enough and people start giving up.

Just the market rearranging itself. Pirates just exist to fullfill a demand void.


What!? Piracy has a legitimate purpose, you say? :evil:

I beg to differ. Pirates exist to destroy the market, by arbitrarily deciding that the creators of product don't need to benefit from it.

And before anybody says it, it has nothing to do with companies "not knowing how to do business in the Internet Age" or what have you. Such nonsense is usually spouted by those who simply want their games for free, and damn the creator. (And whether it's crap product or not is entirely unrelated.) You can't compete with "free."

Piracy (of anything that's still for sale by the owner) has no excuse. It is simply hijacking the market at its own expense.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 7:46 am 
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They provide a service legal or not and function similarly to a black market which is a reaction to an unsatisfactory supply(not enough to satisfy demand or quality is unsatisfactory). Though unlike a traditional black market, they provide this service for free.

But whether or not there are providers, its you the consumer who decides whether or not to initiate transactions with them(IE Download).

Besides, now-a-days they can provide a superior product because many companies have shot themselves in the foot by adding those terrible DRM systems that punish the paying end users - case and point Bioshock. Atleast they weren't stupid enough to charge per activation like EA.

Bottom line, people will get their games and media from the source they like the most. Whether its the little Indie Developer they want to support, the big faceless corporation that does only 2 patches for a game before leaving it for dead, the website that hosts free out of print games, or the hacker that removes crappy DRM.

And I disagree with your 'compete with free' arguement. You can by offering support which pirates do not. You can accept feedback and patch and update the game which pirates can't do. You can make customers feel like the money they pay is going towards developing new games that the customers want which the pirates can't do.

The current business model of disposable games that alot of the major publishers have is what's really killing them. If you take a game like Starcraft that is STILL going strong after 11 years and compare it to something like Tiberium Wars that's a imbalanced disposable eye candy that said FU to story continuity, then its fairly obvious what the difference is. Blizzard supported their game, tweaked it until it worked and worked with the community. EA patched their games a few times and walked off to do the expansion. If you weren't a die hard fan, do you really want to buy a game like that?

Look at Medieval 2: Total War. AWESOME game, very pretty but horribly bug ridden and came out kinda half finished. Do you really want to pay for a game like that? Sega barely let them put out more than 2 balancing patches. Creative Assembly had to fight for the third one to finally fix alot of the game breaking bugs.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 3:00 am 
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antisocialmunky wrote:
They provide a service legal or not and function similarly to a black market which is a reaction to an unsatisfactory supply (not enough to satisfy demand or quality is unsatisfactory). Though unlike a traditional black market, they provide this service for free.

But whether or not there are providers, its you the consumer who decides whether or not to initiate transactions with them(IE Download).


So, what you're saying is that stealing a product is fine, as long as the supply is 'unsatisfactory' (i.e. there isn't enough of it to go around, or its too expensive, the planets aren't aligned right, etc.)

While it may be excusable (to a point) when applied to essentials for living, like food, water, air, and the like, applying this line of reasoning to luxuries (such as video games) is, quite frankly, absurd.

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Besides, now-a-days they can provide a superior product because many companies have shot themselves in the foot by adding those terrible DRM systems that punish the paying end users - case [in] point Bioshock. At least they weren't stupid enough to charge per activation like EA.


The blame for that lies with the pirates, and the pirates alone. If they did not enable theft by proxy, there would be no motivation for companies to implement these draconian DRM systems to begin with.

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Bottom line, people will get their games and media from the source they like the most. Whether its the little Indie Developer they want to support, the big faceless corporation that does only 2 patches for a game before leaving it for dead, the website that hosts free out of print games, or the hacker that removes crappy DRM.


DRM exists because the pirates are distributing software for free. You are asking me to believe that the tail is wagging the dog.

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And I disagree with your 'compete with free' arguement. You can by offering support which pirates do not. You can accept feedback and patch and update the game which pirates can't do. You can make customers feel like the money they pay is going towards developing new games that the customers want which the pirates can't do.


I fail to see your point. The avaliability of the free game decreases demand for a product, which in turn decreases the value of the product, which reduces the profit margin, which makes it all that much harder to do these things to begin with.

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The current business model of disposable games that alot of the major publishers have is what's really killing them. If you take a game like Starcraft that is STILL going strong after 11 years and compare it to something like Tiberium Wars that's a imbalanced disposable eye candy that said FU to story continuity, then its fairly obvious what the difference is. Blizzard supported their game, tweaked it until it worked and worked with the community. EA patched their games a few times and walked off to do the expansion. If you weren't a die hard fan, do you really want to buy a game like that?


This is all rather irrelevant. If I steal a bucket from somebody, it doesn't particularly matter whether its a good, sturdy bucket, or a useless, oxidized dish with holes in it; I'm still stealing it.

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Look at Medieval 2: Total War. AWESOME game, very pretty but horribly bug ridden and came out kinda half finished. Do you really want to pay for a game like that? Sega barely let them put out more than 2 balancing patches. Creative Assembly had to fight for the third one to finally fix alot of the game breaking bugs.


Replace any of these products with something analogous that isn't a video game, and your statement immediately becomes ridiculous. Think about that. ;)

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 3:45 am 
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If i could mix games together to create even better games...

spore+halo(1,2, or 3)

Starcraft+any browser based game

Battle for Wesnoth+BSF (yes, i enjoy my battleships forever)

ect. also, when does bungee take a hint and make halo DS? or halo for wii? or halo for ANY non-xbox or pc system? after all, they are a seperate company from microsoft, they just find that their current deal with microsoft is more "profitable". man, when they do make halo DS, even if i have to come from the DEAD, it's mine!

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 3:59 am 
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flabort wrote:
If i could mix games together to create even better games...

spore+halo(1,2, or 3)

Starcraft+any browser based game

Battle for Wesnoth+BSF (yes, i enjoy my battleships forever)

ect. also, when does bungee take a hint and make halo DS? or halo for wii? or halo for ANY non-xbox or pc system? after all, they are a seperate company from microsoft, they just find that their current deal with microsoft is more "profitable". man, when they do make halo DS, even if i have to come from the DEAD, it's mine!


Bungie* isn't making ANY other halo games for ANYONE other than microsoft. Microsoft has the copyrights: It would cost more than the gain if Bungie made halo for the DS.

They already have a browser game for starcraft, it's just not finished yet.
Search "StarCraft Flash"

Spore Halo would be completely fucking pointless!
Spore is all about free-form creature making.
Halo is about blowing the brains out of aliens, where the only thing you customize is your armor permutations!
They just don't fit together!
Think about these things before you post!!!

Edit: And for the love of god, try to spell like an intelligent person!


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:01 am 
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no...
you make your alien... customize your spartan
and then watch the duel to the death!

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:03 am 
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Hey, I wouldn't mind if you could mix some mindless violence with a creature creator.

Rabbit-Lizards...

With rocket launchers...

= better than rabbit lizards without rocket launchers.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:03 am 
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ACDI)Anton wrote:
no...
you make your alien... customize your spartan
and then watch the duel to the death!


You are stupid.
Spore was not made to be a limited game(though all games are limited in some form.)!!
It's pretty much a gigantic biological SANDBOX.
Restricting it to making an alien to fight a spartan would be pretty fucking stupid.

Edit: Deathshand: You can fight with other people's creatures when SPORE and the Galactic Edition come out in like one month. Yeah, you can't give them weapons. Whoop dee fuckin doo.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:07 am 
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DeathsHand wrote:
Hey, I wouldn't mind if you could mix some mindless violence with a creature creator.

Rabbit-Lizards...

With rocket launchers...

= better than rabbit lizards without rocket launchers.


Making your own versions of ZERG RUSH = priceless.

Weapons are not needed if you have fucking claws, gaping maws, etc.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:10 am 
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Magick wrote:
ACDI)Anton wrote:
no...
you make your alien... customize your spartan
and then watch the duel to the death!


You are stupid.
Spore was not made to be a limited game(though all games are limited in some form.)!!
It's pretty much a gigantic biological SANDBOX.
Restricting it to making an alien to fight a spartan would be pretty fucking stupid.

Edit: Deathshand: You can fight with other people's creatures when SPORE and the Galactic Edition come out in like one month. Yeah, you can't give them weapons. Whoop dee fuckin doo.


okay how does me saying that make me stupid?
this is a nice first impression of the fourms.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:11 am 
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ACDI)Anton wrote:
Magick wrote:
ACDI)Anton wrote:
no...
you make your alien... customize your spartan
and then watch the duel to the death!


You are stupid.
Spore was not made to be a limited game(though all games are limited in some form.)!!
It's pretty much a gigantic biological SANDBOX.
Restricting it to making an alien to fight a spartan would be pretty fucking stupid.

Edit: Deathshand: You can fight with other people's creatures when SPORE and the Galactic Edition come out in like one month. Yeah, you can't give them weapons. Whoop dee fuckin doo.


okay how does me saying that make me stupid?
this is a nice first impression of the fourms.


1. You completely ignored the FACT that SPORE is too freeform to be combined with Halo.
2. You should be glad SWS isn't chewing you out right now. If he was, you probably would've left by now.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:13 am 
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oops, seems i've started a flame war... muh heh hah! heh hoo hoo hah... :twisted:

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:13 am 
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Ignore Magick when he insults people who clearly are more sane than him.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:14 am 
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I must agree with C111 here.


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