Conflicting Factions - Gathering Ideas for CF5

[Normandy]

Well, regardless of Arcalane, I think I may want to go ahead with a Conflicting Factions 5. But this time I'm going to go do it over the summer, so that I may have sufficient time to do stuff (although once I go to camp, I will have to stop it, but that's still a good 6 weeks).

For those of you that don't know, Conflicting Factions is an epic Strategic Roleplaying Game. Start incredibly small, and either through political lithe or military might, work your way to the top. Then get toppled by a small rebel force and see the whole cycle over again.

Basically, I'd like you to help me find the mistakes I had made in the previous CF. And help to shape the ruleset for the next one.

Outline for next CF:

Overall
-List of possible 'regular' actions.
-Use the wiki to store/show information in a fashion everyone can appreciate.
-Everyone is human. Plain ol' organic human. No cyborgs, sentient AIs, or alien life forms.

Turns
-One turn every three days. One tick every day. I'll explain it later.
-Turn-independent actions.

Ship Design
-You pick the size of the ship, what weapons/armor/shields/etc... it will use, and if it has any specials. Dropping the numerical system of CF4
-Production costs will be determined by me.
-A base shipset/base shipsets that all factions will use in the beginning.

Facilities/Infrastructure
-A set list of possible facilities. Each facility has a very specific task.
-Dropping the infrastructure design system of CF4, unnecessary. Replacing it with a far simpler system.

Tags
-(Normal) Resource tags have been dropped. However, resources still have tags associated with them (when those resources are used in construction). Unique resource tags still remain as usual (a five-letter tag).
-A three-letter designation, signifying specialness.
-Any object that can have a tag (unique resources and ships, I believe) are surrounded by <>. Tags are surrounded by [].
-Examples are <Fighter [EXP]>, <Heavy Energy Weapon [CLASR] [PWR]>.
-A list of tags will be in the wiki.

Ship (and other object) Construction
-More defined requirements for building. E.g. a ship will have in requirements "Large Orbital Shipyard", meaning it has to be constructed in a large shipyard in orbit or bigger. Or better. Whatever.

Military Action
-A more defined military action list. For some reason people don't seem to get the concept of 'attacking someone' to attack someone. They appear to want a set number of choices from which they can use, rather than the infinite possibilities of the human mind.

Map and Planets
-Risk-like 'Tile' system for galactic map. Takes one movement point to move one tile. Amount of movement points per turn is determined by the engine of the slowest ship in the fleet.
-Some Tiles will include multiple planets, some will include none. It costs no movement points to move from planet to planet, but after you perform an 'action' (e.g. repairing, unloading, attacking, etc...) on a planet, you cannot move anymore.
-When moving through a tile, you must move through a planet. That means hostile defense systems active on that planet will fire at you. If there are multiple planets on a tile, you can choose which planet to move through.
-Cities on planets. Control over cities, not control over planet. Should lend to ground combat awesomeness.
-Cities, Planets, Map will all appear on the wiki.

Resources
-Once again, another complete rehaul. But this time from that rehaul I was talking about earlier.
-Credits are simplest. They're money. Just about everything uses credits. They are the only resource to have an actual amount.
-After seeing the resource system in another RP similar to CF, I decided to steal a little bit of it, simply because I felt really stupid for not thinking of it before. In other words, we're using Civ style resources. Resource numbers do not count - you either have the resource, or you don't have the resource (same applies to unique resources)
-Once again, metals (the only non-unique resource) will have tags associated with them. However, there will be a number of 'generic' tags in addition to any tags signifying specialness.
-Any construction requiring a metal will have a need for a specific one of these 'generic' tags. (see at bottom for example).

Unique Resources
-There are 8 different types of unique resources: Shield Generator, Electronics, Energy Weaponry, Kinetic Weaponry, Mineral, Engine, Good.
-Each unique resource is followed by a five-letter tag. This identifies the unique resource. For example, if I had a piece of <Energy Weaponry [CLASR]>, and the [CLASR] tag meant 'continuous laser', I would have a continuous laser weapon.
-Unique resources are called unique resources since they perform extremely specific jobs.
-Unique resources are all produced by their own facilities.
-Most are used in ship production, some in infrastructure upgrading, and goods are consumed by the populace (usually producing happiness, sometimes other adverse effects).

Tax
-You can choose to create a new tax. Simply complete the sentence:
A (very light, light, moderately-light, moderate, moderately-heavy, heavy, very heavy) (absolute/percentage [based on (value/income)]) tax/tariff/toll on (people/good) (moving through [opt.]) (area).
-So, say I want to make a light absolute tax on people in my empire. Or a very heavy percentage based on income tax on people in the city Rugbat. Or a moderate percentage based on value toll on ships moving through Rugbat. Three tax ideas right there.






Resource example:
Resources are the most complicated part of my game, so they need to be explained in full.

Let's say we have three different types of metal, Neutronium, Hypersteel, and Titanium.

Neutronium has the [HRD] and the [STR] tags.
Hypersteel has the [HRD] tag.
Titanium has the [LGT] tag.

Now say a ship, in it's resource needs, has a [HRD]. That means that the metal used in constructing the ship needs to have a [HRD] tag for it to be used. Namely in this case, Neutronium and Hypersteel can both be used, since they both have the [HRD] tag.

However, Neutronium has the [STR] tag, so it might be advantageous to use it instead of Hypersteel.

Now if a ship needs a [HRD] metal and a [LGT] metal, than you could use Neutronium and Titanium, or Hypersteel and Titanium. However, you could not use Neutronium and Hypersteel together, since neither one of them has the [LGT] tag.

About resource numbers, it is no longer necessary to keep track of how many resources you have. It's either you have the resource, or you don't have the resource. This is good in that resource management now becomes far less of a problem for both you and me. However, this does introduce new problems: for example, you cannot stockpile resources. And becoming a pirate isn't as sexy any more.

Now for unique resources. First we'll go off with the ones used in ship construction. During the design phase, you'll say you want to have a ship that is armed with:
1x Medium Energy Weapon [CLASR]
4x Small Energy Weapon [PLASR]
10x Small Kinetic Weapon [MASSD]
2x Small Shield Generator [PHASE]

Then, you have to be producing these weapons. Since no city produces all of the parts necessary to construct a ship, you'll have to transport these around. Metals you do not need to transport around, it is assumed they are hauled by civilian transport companies. Unique resources need to be hauled by your own frigates. One frigate can only exclusively hold one type of unique resource (size included), and once that resource is used [that turn], the frigate's cargo hold will be empty.

Now, like the generic tags of metal, just because your <Medium Energy Weapon [CLASR] [PWR]> has an extra tag, doesn't mean you can't use it. As long as it has that [CLASR] tag (and is the same size for called in the design), then it will be usable on the design.

Another thing about these 5-letter tags, is that the tag is more important than the resource it is. <Medium Energy Weapon [CLASR]> means Medium Continuous Laser Cannon. <Small Energy Weapon [PLASR]> means Small Pulsed Laser Cannon. The tag determines what the weapon does, how effective it is in combat, etc...

Now your question may be, why bother? That's because the tag system allows for flexibility, in terms of research. Say you need a faster ship. Now, you could design an entirely new ship, or you could design a new metal type. Say that the metal called for by the ship needs a [LGT] tag. So, you invest money into developing a new metal that has the [LGT] tag, but also the [FST] tag, which makes ships using it go faster. Some time and money later, simply build the new ships using this new metal, and the ships will inherit the [FST] tag, meaning they'll go faster.

Same applies to unique resources (to a point). Say you want a more powerful version of [CLASR]. Develop a better [CLASR] weapon, and you'll get the [PWR] tag (say). Now, any ship using this more powerful laser weapon will get the [PWR] tag, making them fire stronger shots, so you don't have to develop an entirely new class of ships to make your ships stronger.

[Joss]

Sounds fun but complex....

[ChaosTheory]

Methinks you need to pre-determine the infrastucture and ships. One major issue last time was getting up the motivation to make ships and cost lists and the materials and all that. This time, make us a list of 15-20 or so ships and the same number of infrastucture parts, then give each a point value, so all we have to do is build our fleets, allot our buildings, make a faction and get on with it. Customization may be worthwile later, but this will definitely work in the short term - say the factions are all breakoffs of the same military and start with the same blueprints and technology. This also make battles a simple matter of tally points, throw some multiplier dice around and come out with a winner.

Secondly, hold RP value above all else. Winning battles is good, but we want role playing and story thread more than anything (according to the discussion in IRC at least).

Lastly, give us a detailed map. As much info as you can cram into a square, put in there, so we know what resources and what colonies / ships are present.

I may give more imput later. Just simplify, simplify, simplify your rules down to what makes it run and what makes it fun. All else is merely clutter.

[Normandy]

Hrm, good points CT. I really wish I could make this simpler without losing the amount of strategic depth that's in this game, but I cannot. I don't want to sacrifice awesomeness for playability. As compared to other RPs, I believe CF, if it got off the ground, would lead to epic things.

Battle because of aggression by an empire? Boring. Battle because you're trying to capture the only source of <Ore %[STRG]%> in the entire galaxy? Pretty damn nice. Trying to stop a shipment of <Gigantic Laser Cannon %[DEATH]% %[AWES]% %{STRG}% %{POWR}%> to the Huge Orbital Shipyard Complex, so that the First Galactic Empire doesn't finish the huge superlaser weapon, capable of destroying planets without even going full power? Something tells me that's totally freaking awesome.

Anyways, it all seems so simple in my head... Yet all complicated on paper. Telling someone to "Press Ctrl-F, and insert the letters of the tag" takes three or four sentences to explain properly =.=.

[ChaosTheory]

Something tells me that what this really should be is an online RTS. :/

Well, simply try to make the system take as little energy as possible to get off the ground, and remove unnecessary complexity. If it takes to much non-RP thought to keep things moving, poeple won't play. I may want to attack Teh SupaLazr 'O Doom, but if I have to allocate resources, shift my fleets around, and then do various other non-interesting things, it really gets in the way.

The issue is that while resources add some depth to the gameplay, they also add a disproportionate amout of effort needed to follow the numbers and track the planets and whatnot.

I don't know . . . maybe the idea isn't really feasible on a forum, despite my belief it WOULD be awesome. Conflicting Factions + Conflicting Ideas = 1/0

[Normandy]

Alrighty then. How's this:

11 (Habitable) Planets. Anywhere between 1 and 7 cities on each of those planets, usually around 2 or 3 cities. That's only about ~30 cities in total. Combine that with 6 or 7 players, that's not too many cities to keep track of to keep competitive in the game. And I don't think keeping track of the 10 odd cities in your immediate area will be too hard.

[ChaosTheory]

Sounds good. 11 planets might be one or two solar systems worth (1, for simplicity again), the military of which you can say fell apart recently and left 6 or 7 factions on thier own. So now these factions all have the same blueprints, but must mine ore, build ships, and unite the solar system. The 20 pre-designed ships, let's say, take xyz number of resources to build (x, y, and z can be reduced with research) and the factions must compete for resources still, but the numbers aren't so arbitrary for each faction. Then beyond that, we can go custom with SUPA LAZRS O' DOOM or massive dreadnoughts, and still let the gameplay flow freely and not impede the RP aspect.

[Atrum]

The complex haz kill my mind, kthnx.

All I can say ATM.

[Normandy]

Okay, streamlined a whole bunch of things. A lot of the stuff in the outline now just says 'removed this... removed that'.

Also, forgot about taxes.

[Arcalane]

The complex haz kill my mind, kthnx.

All I can say ATM.

That's not exactly hard now, is it?

[falco1029]

oooooh, this looks fun. I never saw any of the others, but I think I'd be interested in this. But I assume more detailed explanations of the game system will be given at a later time?

[Normandy]

Damn, just saw the greatest idea ever at http://z9.invisionfree.com/Galaxy_Inc/index.php?act=idx (join it! It was started by a former BSFer and CF player!). Remove resource amounts.

It's just like civilization. It's either you have the resource, or you don't. It's so much simpler for both me and you, while not compromising too much strategic depth. The only problem is that it makes pirate and corporate factions harder to make sense.

Just to rant about it now, CF isn't just about creating a nation. Just as well you can create an intergalactic trading company or a small roving pirate band.

[Himura.Kenshin]

This thread necro'd ME. Just want you to know that anything you have, sign me up for it. =].

[Normandy]

AH GOD!

THE PAIN!

Check out the 'post thine ideas for an SRP(G)'. The new CF discussion is in there.

[Da Don Mega]

Are you thinking of putting in a background story for it? You know, something to set the scene for everything to begin from