Random acts of violence with shipmaker

Post by **Kaelis** » Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:26 am

I understand your frustration and agree that you should have gotten much more advice - or at least someone should pointed it out that the ships aren't any good.

However, in this case, the problem with feedback is that theres not much to be said, at least in my opinion. Not only these ships are ugly and use huge, undetailed custom sections on which they seem to rely, but theyre vastly different from everything else. To be honest, i don't know and don't see how they could be improved. This is why im suggesting to just scrap the style and start anew. So from my point of view, i understand why there was no feedback - people just didnt know what to suggest.

Post by **Anna** » Mon Aug 31, 2009 3:45 am

For the record, I had nothing to do with this banning, I didn't even know about it until Arcalane informed me.

I'm sure as hell not complaining though.

And jwa... I have to agree with pretty much everything Kaelis said. I believe I've tried giving you constructive criticism before, but it seemed like it got largely ignored and I'm not going to bother trying to help someone who can't learn.

jwa8402 · Post by **jwa8402** » Mon Aug 31, 2009 4:26 am

Anna wrote: And jwa... I have to agree with pretty much everything Kaelis said. I believe I've tried giving you constructive criticism before, but it seemed like it got largely ignored and I'm not going to bother trying to help someone who can't learn.

Um, I don't want a flame war but I have to comment on this. Of my three main threads that I can find since I joined the forum (not saying I don't have other threads but they were mostly single ships) I can only count one time you have ever commented in any of them(and I followed your advice!), so I'm afraid I must call bullshit on that. The only time I've ever disagreed with you was on backseat modding, which I hope you will admit I've stopped completely for sometime now.

Actually every time someone has said a technique I'm trying isn't working, I've tried to switch to a different style. So you may call me talentless, but I do at least listen to advice given to me even if I'm not good at executing it. I'm genuinely sorry you don't have more patience, because I think you could make pretty much everyone here an excellent builder. I'm even more disappointed you can't accept someone's admission of their own failure, and their desire to improve with your help, without further insulting them. It is the sign of a truly weak person, but I hope in the future I can do better in your eyes. This thread can be locked.

Post by **Anna** » Mon Aug 31, 2009 4:44 am

jwa8402 wrote:Um, I don't want a flame war but I have to comment on this. Of my three main threads that I can find since I joined the forum (not saying I don't have other threads but they were mostly single ships) I can only count one time you have ever commented in any of them(and I followed your advice!), so I'm afraid I must call bullshit on that. The only time I've ever disagreed with you was on backseat modding, which I hope you will admit I've stopped completely for sometime now.

Yeah, you're quite probably right there. It may be that my memory is acting up. It isn't perfect unfortunately, and neither am I, although sometimes I may act like I think I am. So yeah, it looks like I was wrong in this instance, ad I apologise.

Actually every time someone has said a technique I'm trying isn't working, I've tried to switch to a different style. So you may call me talentless, but I do at least listen to advice given to me even if I'm not good at executing it. I'm genuinely sorry you don't have more patience, because I think you could make pretty much everyone here an excellent builder. I'm even more disappointed you can't accept someone's admission of their own failure, and their desire to improve with your help, without further insulting them. It is the sign of a truly weak person, but I hope in the future I can do better in your eyes. This thread can be locked.

Not having patience is a problem that I've struggled with for some time, and often I just feel too frustrated to try offering constructive criticism when I feel there's too much wrong with it. Largely due to previous experiences where my constructive criticism was ignored.

I honestly only skimmed over your last post, and I really didn't intend to insult you in this instance. I agree I've been somewhat of a complete asshole in this thread, and I would like to try and help you improve, without the dumbass insults that I sometimes tactlessly throw out, if you're still interested in getting my help.

So I'll leave this thread unlocked, and if you really want it locked, just let me know. If not... I'll try to formulate some proper constructive criticism for you soon.

25000st · Post by **25000st** » Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:28 am

Jwa, what if you tried copying someone else's style for a little bit? It might give you some inspiration.

Post by **Anna** » Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:40 am

25000st wrote:Jwa, what if you tried copying someone else's style for a little bit? It might give you some inspiration.

Honestly, I kind of have to disagree with this. I mean, at face value you might think it's a good idea, but attempting to directly duplicated a style that doesn't come naturally to you often ends up with forced and generally poor-looking ships.

What I would recommend though is looking closely at other people's designs, picking out good elements of every design style, and attempting to adapt them into your own unique style.

Post by **Kaelis** » Mon Aug 31, 2009 9:09 am

Jwa, i was about to post a list of things that went wrong with your last ships, but ive realized that it would be largely futile due to the advent of SW style. I think you should try your hand at it, as im fairly certain that pretty much everything looks better in SW style.

Crimsonflame · Post by **Crimsonflame** » Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:32 pm

On a side note, should you really want to get involved in making custom sections then i would suggest taking other people's sections and modifying them to suit your needs as a start. (don't release them without their consent of course) Speaking from what little experience i have, its a very effective way to kick things off.

jwa8402 · Post by **jwa8402** » Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:46 pm

@Crimsonflame: You wouldn't believe the size of my modded sprites folder. Making the sprite isn't the problem, its filling in the right amount of detail, but point well taken.
@Anna: Thank you, that means a lot. Believe me, I have been no less frustrated with my ships, which is perhaps why I started churning out the first thing I could put together. I will try to improve and I trust you to tell me if I don't.
@Kaelis: I agree, though I hadn't wanted to cheat since pretty much everything seems to look good using those. Still, I'm sure I can prove that statement wrong

I'm still gonna lurk for awhile but I had one last ship I wanted feedback on. I actually did use the swa sprites on it, and also tried to go the complete opposite of what I've been doing: alien, colors, no attempted huge gun decks. I'm not particularly happy with how dark it is though...

Post by **Anna** » Mon Aug 31, 2009 3:10 pm

Yeah, the dark outer part of the ship is somewhat way too dark, and the over-all shape of it isn't especially eye-catching either. It's lacking a really interesting external shape. Instead it just seems more or less like a shapeless blob.

On the flipside though, the internal detailing and structure is really quite well done, and I really dig those very thin strip of glowy-stuff engines. I don't like the glowy engine core, though... it can be done much better than that, I think.

25000st · Post by **25000st** » Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:49 am

Make sure to change the blending of any glowy-type section to additive. I also believe I see a mirroring error near the back. I've also noticed it seems the overall shape of your ships seems to be the problem. Your section usage is... not too bad. What if you made your ships more torpedo or knife shaped? Idk, just a thought.